A Change in Values
Some commentators are saying that the large swing to the greens was not entirely a protest vote, but a real change in values.
I think we are seeing some of the effects of a very large and profound transition from the old industrial age to the new post-carbon age. one of the essential changes is for all humans to adopt new values, such as responsibility for one's actions and awareness of how our actions affect our environment, other people, other creatures and our present and future sustainability.
Essentially, as at all times of transition, its a battle between the old, who fear change, and the new, who fear non-change as they can see the dangers of staying in the past. balance is necessary as change, if too rapid, can destabilise.
I suspect we will see as many political changes coming up as we will increasingly see vast changes in weather patterns.
What do others think?
You make a very good point Kika, we have neglected the country terribly and should be ashamed.
I found this comment by a young woman which demonstrates how our values clash with our children.
[i]I was brought up in a really strict Catholic family. It was just expected that we would go to church every Sunday and that we would "uphold the Catholic faith" as my parents put it. I never bothered to rebel against religion like many of my friends did. For some reason I couldn't quite subject myself to my parent's disappointment. My parents and I never really saw eye to eye about anything. When I was younger it was just the simple stuff - the length of my skirt, how I chose to wear my hair or the movies I wanted to watch. But as I got older I found that there was a lot more that we didn't agree on - my choice of friends, what I wanted to study at uni, political issues or how I chose to spend my weekends.
I left home at 17 to study at a University. Moving away from home has totally broadened my outlook on the world and has changed my opinion on lots of issues. Over the past two years I've met the most amazing people with the most extraordinarily diverse experiences. My circle of friends includes people with different religions, beliefs, values, cultures and different ways of approaching life. But the great thing is we respect each other's opinions. I've learnt to question what I've been taught and not always agree just because that is what "everybody else" thinks.
The first couple of times I went home to visit my parents I found it really hard to cope. I found it hard to deal with not being able to express my opinions as freely as I did when I was away from home. My mum didn't necessarily agree with my upfront attitude to life. While I was always out there trying to get people to take me and my beliefs and opinions seriously, her attitude was "why fight it... why not just go with the flow." It was really frustrating. I used to get really upset that my parents didn't agree with what I was doing.
I kept at it though. I used to ring home and tell mum about a new project or committee I'd become involved with and even though I could just see her cringing on the other end of the phone line, I tried to remember why I was doing what I was doing or why I held the beliefs that I did. I found that I really had to remind myself that it was okay to have the opinions that I did, but also that it was okay for my mum to have her viewpoint too.[/i]
I agree with the above--parents do not have the right to tell their kids how to think once they have grown--It is also good to have friends with different opinions and even a Husband or wife.
I have many friends that are a total opposite of me but we agree to disagree and have been friends for 40 years or more in a lot of cases. I would hate to have to "go with the flow" if I didn't agree. However I am willing to listen to others because you never know they might turn out to be right and it makes for an interesting discussion.
No one could ever accuse you of going with the flow PB, you always express yourself without worrying what anyone else thinks.
No one could ever accuse you of going with the flow PB, you always express yourself without worrying what anyone else thinks.
I hope I don't offend anyone as I never mean to
Yes growing up in my time with friends with different points of view
was very painful it was only after many arguments and fights, they
finally come to their senses, realizing that while disagreeing with my
wonderful points of view, I never brought them a beer,
as soon as that dawned on them and they agreed with me,
any a night was lost in an alcoholic haze, and we got on very well
and our friendship became permanent
as at those nights after a few drinks
they could fully appreciate the wisdom in my words.
As we all know the more you drink the wiser you seem to be.
also you seem to understand very badly slurred speech with clarity.
Someone has to take charge. even an uphill battle.with friends.
Why is any advice from parents being so casually dismissed!
of course parents have the right to advise their children
irrespective of their age, just as the child has the right to to refuse.
I am sure parents out their have given advice to their adult children.
We parents can see things that can harm them and try to advise them
against whatever it may be. I for one am still asked by my children who
are aged from 53 to 63yrs.not so much for advice but what do I think
the outcome would be.if they go ahead. I dont want to ruffle any feathers,
but we made sure our children were involved in sunday school and
church activities knowing full well that when reaching the teenage years
they would pull away from the church but would have the moral and
spiritual teachings to help them make good choices. It is no good
saying children can make up their own mind when they have nothing to
compare against..
Last but not least if your parents still want to advise you as an adult,
then you are truly blessed, There are plenty of people out there who
are so alone who would welcome their parents concern with open arms.
Look beyond your own ego and see what your parents have to offer.
I agree Seth--but advice is different from not allowing or putting down your kids if they have a different opinion--I still advise my Son but I don't not allow him to have his own opinions. I also agree that when the kids are growing up they have to have boundaries and need guidence. Parents do have a lot to offer I do agree with that.
Koko, you've made an interesting comment: "I find it extremely annoying that some people who are more inclined toward Green /left politics , assume that more conservative voters are not concerned with pollution and the environment. ".
If conservative voters really are concerned with pollution and environment I am wondering why they tend to vote against reduction in logging of old growth forests, for more and more polluting mining, more urban sprawl, greater immigration, more roads, more cars, greater exploration for oil/gas on our barrier reef, less investment and government support for clean renewable energy sources, etc....
If conservative voters really were concerned with pollution and destruction of our environment, would our country be in the dire state it is in today? (I'm referring to the poor state of our environment.)
it may be that you are an exception and really do care about these things, so i'm wondering who you vote for and what your reasons might be?
I have no idea why people vote as they do nor do I believe I'm an exception.
You appear to be fairly new on the forum, otherwise you would have seen many posts of mine and others of a conservative mind, where these topics have been discussed ad nauseum.
. I do believe also that in general there is more awareness of the environment to day across the whole voting populace.
I vote Liberal, and the reason is that the Liberal Party's philosophy is individual freedom, as opposed to say the Greens especially, who want to regiment us in every area of our lives....and The ALP is much the same, even though in some respects they [i]appear[/i] to have moved slightly right of centre.
The ALP have the unions and all their money behind them, and they have lied and lied.
In fact, with this last election my feelings have been cemented forever toward the ALP. The lies and denigration of Tony Abbott that were told in this latest campaign were disgraceful.
Nicola Roxon, a week before the election had to admit that their (ALP) statements and ads about Abbott supposedly ripping a $$billion from Health, was a lie. But of course, by that time the brainwashing had worked, and the lie was repeated on all the blogs and in conversation. What little people they are. Vile.
Talking of values, Abbott, a wonderful, clean living family man, who lives by old fashioned principles is mocked for these things.
The ALP, who set themselves up as our moral and physical police, and who exhort us all to live healthy lives, actually spent the last 6 to eight months mocking Abbott for his physical fitness. What hypocrisy.
Koko,
What a load of pure garbage has escaped from your saintly hand,
surely you are not saying that Tony Abbott never lied?
did you ever find out more about the great big new mining tax he was
raving about and what it really was. When he was in the Howard
government the lies told to the people of Australia was astronomical
in there scope. Why do you think he was thrown out of government
Are you also saying that 50% of australians are not as intelligent as you.
if so your ego is as big as your load of rubbish.
By Koko:- I find it quite amusing at times, to see one or two or three only ever pop up to make smart alec remarks and to criticise individuals.............usually me or BigVal...
________________________________________________________________
Please try to get that chip off your shoulders Koko not everyone here hates you
trully [b]if you start a friendly post others will join in[/b]. I have found the forum great
just try and you will also see it can be fun.
If you care to look through the archives you'll see I've posted many topics under General. Many lovely videos , and stories. I also have started and continued 2 headings of Midday smiles.
[b]There are about two people who bother to respond.[/b]
Over the years on this forum I used to welcome each newcomer, and one was yourself, and have [u]never[/u] had an acknowledgement.
Look at the responses I get from my political posts!
Today is a perfect example.
I will continue to post if and when I feel like it, and whatever anyone else thinks of me is their problem.
koko, thank you for responding, but you did not answer my question.
To say Abbott never lied--that is pure rubbish for a start--he also did nothing but put the ALP down and every statement included "The Big new tax" as did all of the Libs like it was scripted. As far as his fitness goes I doubt anyone mocks him for this, but maybe because of the way he struts about?
As far as his principals goes well he did make a mistake with sex outside marriage but he preaches that this isn't right --seems he is saying --"Do as I say not what I do"--
As I have said b4 he was the head kicker for Hansen and also the way he treated Bernie Banton--is that clean and Christen ? He also did rip a heap from health. He also changes his thoughts IF he thinks it will get him the top job.
I am also not keen on Gillard as she also leaves a lot to be desired. To tell you the truth I am over the both of them and I think most are and thats why we had the outcome we did.
You have made some good points PlanB.
Remember the "Australians for Honest Politics Trust" that Abbott established to politically assasinate Pauline Hanson and ended up with her going to prison on a charge which was later overturned, leading to criticism of a range of politicians for political interference in the justice system.
I hope he feels good knowing he has sent an innocent person to prison.
I found this comment by a young woman which demonstrates how our values clash with our children.
[i]I was brought up in a really strict Catholic family. It was just expected that we would go to church every Sunday and that we would "uphold the Catholic faith" as my parents put it. I never bothered to rebel against religion like many of my friends did. For some reason I couldn't quite subject myself to my parent's disappointment. My parents and I never really saw eye to eye about anything. When I was younger it was just the simple stuff - the length of my skirt, how I chose to wear my hair or the movies I wanted to watch. But as I got older I found that there was a lot more that we didn't agree on - my choice of friends, what I wanted to study at uni, political issues or how I chose to spend my weekends.
I left home at 17 to study at a University. Moving away from home has totally broadened my outlook on the world and has changed my opinion on lots of issues. Over the past two years I've met the most amazing people with the most extraordinarily diverse experiences. My circle of friends includes people with different religions, beliefs, values, cultures and different ways of approaching life. But the great thing is we respect each other's opinions. I've learnt to question what I've been taught and not always agree just because that is what "everybody else" thinks.
The first couple of times I went home to visit my parents I found it really hard to cope. I found it hard to deal with not being able to express my opinions as freely as I did when I was away from home. My mum didn't necessarily agree with my upfront attitude to life. While I was always out there trying to get people to take me and my beliefs and opinions seriously, her attitude was "why fight it... why not just go with the flow." It was really frustrating. I used to get really upset that my parents didn't agree with what I was doing.
I kept at it though. I used to ring home and tell mum about a new project or committee I'd become involved with and even though I could just see her cringing on the other end of the phone line, I tried to remember why I was doing what I was doing or why I held the beliefs that I did. I found that I really had to remind myself that it was okay to have the opinions that I did, but also that it was okay for my mum to have her viewpoint too.[/i]