Hi Maureen your daughter is carrying a lot of guilt for leaving for those 12 years and knowing she was replaced by you amplifies that. It comes out in her wanting to distance herself from you so she can rebuild relationships with her children again. These kids will remember the time she was not there when they grid and have their own families and karma might come and bite her on the bum. Keep communication open with your grand kids and just let her be. She is 50? She has her own mind as to what has made her dislike you and emotionally she is stuck there in that time. Life is too short look after yourself. 

Hi again,

I have this little verse handy and have found it's words comforting,thought I would share it with you all.

Today

I've shut the door on yesterday

 It's sorrows and mistakes.

I've locked within it's gloomy walls

past failures and heartaches.

And now I throw the key away

to seek another room.

And furnish it with hope and smiles

and every springtime bloom.

No thought shall enter this abode,

that has a hint of pain.

All worry malice and distrust

shall never therin reign.

I've shut the door on yesterday

and thrown the key away.

The future holds no doubt for me

since I have found today.   May all your days be beautiful !  God Bless

Thats is beautiful and I have copied it....

I have thought long and hard about troubles with daughters etc and really think a lot to do with the change of life...One of my daughters has been so arrogant and sarcastic for some years and a friend of hers once saw me on a train going home from work..she said she Imy daughter) hadnt grown up.....other people do notice things but loath to say anyting to you.....maybe and only maybe in their childhood we spoilt them...did too much running around them etc.....it seems to be a pandemic amongst some in the western world families.....some young men too act similarly and never see much of their mothers....I have a lovely lady friend in the same boat too.....all I can ever say is just keep on loving them and be the loving Mother we are and wait in the wings while getting on a little wit our own lives......why is it that we can have such great friendships with women and men  like ourselves but yet we yearn to have the same with our daughters and sons......

A few observations... keeping in mind that the reverse can also be true.

Teens generally have less contact with grandparents (oldies). It is a normal part of growing toward adulthood.

Children (of any age) often blame their parent(s) for their own mistakes, shortcomings and failures.

People (in general) are becoming more callous and indifferent toward older people.

Some people are only interested in their parents or grandparents if they think they will benefit in some way e.g. financially.

That said:-

It is important to be independent and careful - especially as we get older. Various circumstances change e.g. relationships, finances, emotions, support systems, health, mental health, motives - and memories (yours and others).

If you must write a letter, take your time to compose it. Be sure it says what you wish to say - without begging, whining, accusing etc. Get a sensible person who knows the intended recipient to read it. Listen to their opinion. Then think again. Then put it aside for a few weeks. Read it again and ask yourself if you really think it will improve the situation (probably not).

Move on. Do not allow your happiness and future to be dependent on your children or grandchildren. Protect yourself from "Elder Abuse" - financially, physically, emotionally etc.

  A hundred years from now... it will not matter

  what my bank account was, the sort of house I

            lived in or the kind of car I drove.

   But the world may be different because I was

            important in the life of a child.

   Children are the flowers in the garden of life !!

If this abusive situation goes on for a long time there are only two options.

You either put up with it, and accept it on an ongoing basis, or you put a stop to it no matter what the cost. That cost being perhaps the loss of contact with grandchild/children.

The only 'comfort' for me is that this is not unusual; so many people go/are going through it. I have found also that it has little to do with having made mistakes or being a 'bad' parent. I have a friend who is an absolute Earth Mother! 3 out of her 4 children are violent/embittered/drug addicted.

I believe as a parent we have to try to navigate this and attempt to resolve it, or try to make it at least more tolerable.

I equally believe that that philosophy must have a cut off point to frankly save health and sanity. I reached it after 33 years. I have done 'the letter'-that was 12 years ago-i sat up literally all night writing it and going over it carefully; it did not work. Nothing worked.

I am unashamed to say that I neither hate nor love my middle aged child. I have even stopped hurting at the loss of my mid 20's grandson who 'has heard ALL about me' since he was a toddler.

Interestingly as a toddler/youngster/adolescent/and teenager he never judged me, but 'the man' is protecting his Mother; as I suppose it should be.

I have never at any point been able to say too much to the younger man because I did not want to upset him. The mature son does not even allow me to even mention his Mother! There is no animosity on the rarest occasions I have spoken to him (twice in 7 years),-just the silent wall that 'I don't go there'.

I accept it now without hurt because I also know that he had a choice to maintain contact or not.

I would have made the break so many years ago, but my child will not leave me alone. It has nothing to do with love; it is the simple need for me to be there for her. Nothing else. I have spent countless years getting them out of so many scrapes-and have been abused all the way through.

I am looking forward to going abroad soon. As another poster has said; I will not tell them. I want my remaining years to be more peaceful after decades of trauma.

IF you have made all effort; then you accept the situation as it is; or you tell your Daughter and Grandchildren that you will not put up with it anymore. You tell the Grandy's that they can judge you, but you hope if they do, that they will understand in the future.

To be very blunt; if they don't they are no loss.

This situation has destroyed the health and wellbeing of so many people. It is up to us frankly to put up or shut up.

......................to use modern parlance: rant over!

Your responsibility as a parent is to provide food, clothing, shelter, health care, education and life lessons - but only until they are adults. 

It is not your responsibility to care for your grown children - or your grandchildren.

Even if there are exceptional circumstances e.g. the parent dies or the person is disabled,  your health and wellbeing should not be pushed aside. You are not required to become a sacrificial offering on the altar of selfishness, greed, bad behaviour - or even misfortune.

If you make a happy life for yourself and ignore wahat the are doing, you will feel a lot better. You will earn their respect and you will be giving them the greatest gift - allowing them to grow up (this includes your "adult" children).

As you distance yourself, they will do one of three things - continue to ignore you, try to give you a "guilt" trip, or improve their behaviour to a standard which is acceptable to you. Personally, I would opt for option one (with your daughter) - as (in my experience) "leopard's don't change their spots" and I would always be waiting for further problems to arise.

It's unclear as to the best way to handle the situation in which you, your daughter and grandchildren are.  It is good to always keep the lines of communication open except if you feel you are being emotionally abused. Possibly your grandchildren will be influenced in a negative way by their mother in regard to who you are but they will also have had their own experiences with you which would potentially be a counterbalance.  As the grandchildren try to re-make a relationship with their mother, it will probably be hard for them to maintain the same degree of loyalty to you that they once might have had, particularly if their mother is being negative about you in the attitudes to you she expresses to them.  I would say, give them time and don't go out of your way to try to "set them straight".  Young people are capable of making observations although they may not incorporate them into their behaviour for quite some time.  If your daughter feels guilty or bad about herself, it will show in her behaviour towards you and maybe this is what she has been demonstrating.  There's no need for you also to feel guilty or bad about yourself though - we know that "misery loves company".   Just focus on enjoying the things in life that you can and do - don't be tempted to "strike back" because of a sense of injustice (no matter how justifiable such a feeling may be) or because of the emotional pain you feel. Things may or may not change in the future but it would be good not to add to the emotional burdens which all involved may feel.  A letter, if not written from a sense of self-righteousness or a desire to "retaliate" and hurt, might be helpful - any opinion sought by you on such a letter if you write it should be from a qualified professional helper such as a psychologist rather than relatives or friends.  I hope you can come to a position of acceptance and peace about any aspect of your life you are unable to change for the better. 

It is so painful when the child you adored and who adored you grows into a selfish, self absorbed adult. I have had my feelings hurt so many times, that I have decided not to pursue the relationship any more, for my own spiritual and mental health. Of course there is an ache in my heart, but apart from that, I am feeling better in myself. I hope that one day as they mature more (which is doubtful as is nearlhy 50) things will change.

After many many years this is my time now, and I am niether answerable to or responsible for no one. And that is a powerful feeling. 

Hello,

Forget laying it on the line in a letter,just sit down and tell her to her face,and,don't hold back.

I am 60 years old and one of five children,(one deceased 1983,father deceased 1987) We moved from Liverpool England to Sydney Australia in 1968,my whole life has seemed to have been lived "upside down"

I was diagnosed at 59 with ADHD,this has explained to me why my thoughts and my life choices were different to everyone around me,I have and still do feel that i was never a part of my family,i knew from a very,very young age that i was different.

My mother has just moved into a nursing home in Perth,she is 90 years old and i only talk to her at Xmas at my brothers house in Perth and i send her a Mothers Day card every year with flowers if i can afford it.

Do i love my Mother? Yes,of course she is my Mother,but,and a big but,has she been a good Mother,well I think not,to an outsider she is a great person,an avid Christian and always doing charitable works and for all intents and purposes a very nice well ordered person.

When i was a child in Liverpool in the 50's we were very poor as was everyone else in England after the war,but,my Mother and her sisters 4 of em were brought up in a very strict Victorian household which they loved dearly,in my Mothers memoirs which i have,all the kids have a copy,she tells of her love of going to church every Sunday with my Granfather ( I never met him ) I was brought up in this "household" home and you would swear it was the 20's not the 50's,myself and two older brothers when i was 5 they 6 & 9 had to go to Church every Sunday until we left England in 1968.

Well,I absolutely hated it and let them know i did,well dident i cop it,it was non stop from this wonderfull Church going Protestant women,the more she pushed the more i fought back, I was a handfull in the full sense of the word,I had full on ADHD but was unaware of it,I know it now but then I was just a kiddie with a chemical imbalance in the brain,did i get help,no,there was no help then,i was virtually treated as a defective product and even now I am "the black sheep" of the family.

Where am I going with this?

Well,I was not the problem,my Mother was the problem,to look at her now you would swear that butter woulden't melt in her mouth she is so nice and gentle and forgiving,but she was a cold hard religious wierdo,whose maxim was "do as I say,not as I do"

Do any of you remember the old fashioned blocks of carbolic soap,the big red ones,do you know that one of them blocks (they were big to a 6-7-8 yr old) fitted into my mouth?

To this day I still remember my childhood,some happy times too,especially Christmas,but I was a sick little boy,always in and out of hospital,I have always been sick/accident prone because of the ADHD i have led what can only be described as a "risky" life" I have to this day no fear of danger,that is ADHD for you.

So when you sit down with your daughter (no letter mate) she does not want a letter,you sit and listen intently,do not butt in when she talks,encourage her to let all this suppressed anger/angst out,you may learn something,and before you condemn her get her to see a pshycologist and I think you may be surprised by the result.I was and it answered questions i have had for the past 55 years.

Listen to her,show compassion not condemnation,why not show your daughter this thread??

Ask your daughter to write a post here,call it "A Letter To My Mother"

It may help you know,both sides of a story written honestly may be the start to being able to understand your daughter better,no letter though,face to face and both sober not drinking alcohol at all.

Kind Regards Billyx

I had actually ventured away from YLC, and had deleted notifications....apparently not on this thread! Something I'm now grateful for.

I can empathise billyknows; you describe my Mater to a large degree, BUT:

we have to stop blaming the previous generation for everything. All parents have some degree of guilt. Many are cruel beyond belief. Some have no idea of the damage they cause, because they believe they were doing 'what was best'.

Without a doubt, life experience with a parent/s affects us. It affected me; and I am only too well aware that my faults as a parent affected my child.

I am also well aware that when we post, we post from literally our own point of view; with that obvious and natural bias to how WE feel.

I still venture to suggest though, that the OP here conveys strongly a long path. IF this is correct; spending so long trying to resolve issues, then there DOES come a cutoff point, to save one's own well being, whether that solution is 'correct' or not; it is human.

There are so many different experiences, but I can say from personal experience that after three decades I will no longer 'sit and listen', because I have done that for years; you have my word on it. Unfortunately IF one has experienced what I have, they are only to well aware that such action lets a very very, demanding child have what they crave, an obedient audience,-because it is 'all about them'. They get what they want: again, and again, and again.

Your circumstance may have been entirely different, but you should not presuppose that these children have not been listened to; repeatedly.

I hope that the OP has managed to find a solution. Not the perfect solution; there isn't one; but A solution. Above all else I remain of the view that there IS a cutoff point, because without it ALL parties continue on unhappily, and health slowly disintegrates for all.

Hmmmm, I think we are going to have a long and very interesting conversation here BK!

You have made a number of assumptions.

-I didn't/don't find your post/s 'confronting', and I doubt any other poster does. This is a discussion and folks express their views-most of those views are strong because of the nature of the topics here. We all continue on. At least it shows that our generation has backbone, and are not the doddery old fools stereotype!

-Bias? I am biased; you are biased; most are biased because they write as 'self'.

-Your bias shows in the statement:

"and everyone reading this thread is already biased toward her; she is already guilty (not guilty;guilty)."

Strong bias I suggest. Suggesting 'everyone', and repeating the word 'guilty'.

-You are transposing your own bitterness (sorry kiddo, but it shows), onto the OP's situation, suggesting some kind of internet vendetta against this lass!

That is astonishing! Your Life Choices is just that; life choices. People come here for advice or information. Professionals and others respond. If we take any post anywhere that refers to an individual experience, and criticise the OP for only providing 'one side', the WWW discussion forums would get so bogged down, that no one would dare to ask for any advice at all!!

-I am not a 'fence sitter' and neither are you BK. Your response here has more to do with your own experience, than defending this lass. My posts reflect my own experience also.

-The original post was back in early March. The OP should not be made to feel guilty for asking advice.

I hope you have been able to achieve some modicum of peace with your issues BK, but they are your issues, and not those of the OP.

I look forward to chatting further with you.

BK: you've made response this time very easy.

I much appreciate that you have made things very clear. I now fully understand the problem.

Thanks.

.......................I think you might have misunderstood me BK, but not to worry eh?

I have not changed my view-at all.

Have a nice day.