Prescription medicines and generics

I have had a bad experience overnight. I use Panamax Forte as a pain killer on bad nights to sleep - I use them sparingly too so last me a while. I got a new script filled on 30th December and opened it up last night and it wasn't my usual Panamax Forte but a different one called Codalgin Forte. Now it supposedly had 30 mg of codeine in each capsule like Panamax Forte has. So I took one at 10pm going to bed early as leg ached and I cant sleep without a strong painkiller on these nights it plays up - well by 11pm it hadn't kicked in so took a second one making it 60mg of codeine. By now I was back in the lounge room sitting up as I cant get comfortable lying down when it is that painful and that is why I need the strong one. I couldn't sleep there either so waited out the time 4hrs and tried taking 2 Panadeine tablets which each have 8mg of codeine in them = 16 mg. They worked after a fashion and enough to go back to bed and sleep lightly until 6am.
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Weird as you would expect 60mg to work and if not some might say my body has got too used to it - but then 18mg worked enough to dull the pain if not strong enough to sleep deeply without being conscious of it at the same time.
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Today I went back to the chemist and told them I had said I did not want a generic and they changed it over for me to real drug.
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I get so sick of this as recently found they had slipped in a generic on another drug I use and had wondered why it wasn't as efficient.
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BTW it cost me $4.30 extra to get the real drug that was tested and trialled for years to be approved onto the market. Whereas these generics only have to have the active ingredient in them and the fillers can be different the Pharmacist (owns the shop) told me and she has marked my file now with no generics at all - thank goodness.
She told me that generics do not always work as well as the original drug - so I asked her why then do your assistants ask "Do you want the cheaper drug" when they should say generic drug as most of us understand that generics are cheap and were developed for third world countries who couldn't afford first world meds.
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As God only issued me with one body I want to keep it as healthy as possible don't you?
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Blow using third world meds - we are supposed to be a wealthy country and if the UK as someone recently posted can give their pensioners FREE scripts - why are we having to pay when we have paid our way all our lives by working and paying our taxes and are due a bit of TLC when we are elderly.
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I will finally get a specialist appointment next month and find out why this pain is so blooming awful as it is not arthritis the GP says. Not in the joint.
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If I had the money I would have kept the rotten ones that didn't work and I would have had them tested to see just what was in them - just cant have had 30mg of codeine in each by my reckoning.
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Meanwhile kept the batch number and will write to TGA and manufacturer and ask for the batch to be checked as they have to keep one of every batch for checking. Wont do much good but worth the effort. Cynical old me reckons they all lie these days of greed before compassion. They are supposed to do random checks on these generic drugs but then I well remember Pan Pharmaceuticals a well renowned manufacturer where random checks were supposedly being carried out and where it was discovered by a patient having bad affects that short cuts were being taken to increase profits due to greed once again - don't you?
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But really a warning that things are not always as they seem and you can think you are going nuts if you don't know it can happen to anyone. Nothing worse than people not believing you when you do know your own body.

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Interesting Val as they always tell you that the Genetic ones are the same--I too an very cynical--



Good on you for taking those steps to find out more--



I also have dreadful pain in the leg--it is however coming from my back--maybe yours is as well ?

Plan B - well I got a good nights sleep last night - because the Panadeine Forte worked - so not me - it is obvious there was not the amount of codeine in the tablets as should be. Many would say I am nuts - but I do know that we are in a period of greed.

Ended up taking one Panadeine Forte 30g codeine and one Panadeine 8 g of codeine at 10pm lasted til 1.20 when I woke leg throbbing - took same again - and that lasted me all night til 7.30am. Pain is definitely worse when I lie down than when I walk about or sit

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I don't know the cause of the pain she said having been to doctor with it over last year several times - just that it is shocking - left leg thigh muscle and lower one too this time. Thought it was pulled muscles last year due to being on Moderetic and the doctor not telling me that after 4 years it had leached out all my magnesium from muscles and that causes you to pull one and pain. Also had pulled muscles in my back due to same.

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I have been taking the Magnesium tablets - Blackmore's MagMin for 3 months now and the restless legs and cramp had gone but I have had cramp in that one leg for the last couple of nights. Hubbie says must insist they do something right now and forget the BP which this Doc is focused on - last one was focused on cholesterol.

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That is the thing I wonder about - so many of our natural medicines have no side effects but the chemical ones the Doc give you do. They cannot of course prescribe natural ones - we buy them over the counter - but it is many of these that are important to our health - so much so - I think we have to take notice.

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For example on looking up wods of stuff on Blood Pressure - find that high BP gives you stroke but also they tell you to keep your heart healthy and not have an attack you need to make sure you have sufficient Vitamin D, Vitamin C and Magnesium. All of which you can just go buy. I did now take D & C as well since jan 09.

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Do you see what I mean?

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There is this conflict of interest between what the drug companies make for Doctors to prescribe and sometimes out of natural medicines found in jungles that people have used for years before Docs came to be plus chemicals they add and which work but have various serious and not so serious side effects - and natural ones which also work but cant be prescribed as not on the PBS and have no side effects. So you have Naturalists who prescribe the natural ones but whom many people do not trust as the Doctors in the past have poo poo'd them but now Docs tell you to go buy Glucosamine for arthritis as it works better than the drug on the PBS - as long as you can eat shellfish - if it has not yet been withdrawn that is - which they found was killing people :(

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This leg pain started February last year when I thought I had pulled a muscle - went to old doctor who said rest it and use heat lamp which I did. Still do every day again Nov and December as had left it off but pain was worse - maybe why on Friday last again in Woolworth's felt like it pulled again just walking around. See what happens is I go to get into the car and cant lift my leg literally and you get in with left leg so not only painful but blooming scary for the month of December wasn't able to drive as couldn't get in the car and on Friday was first time I had driven myself. Only had to get into the car twice before leg went. Came out and bam - had to lift leg - use my hand to haul it up like a sack of spuds - not much fun being old is it? I am trying to get one of those seats that swivel that go on top of your car seat but cant find one and not walking so good and being driven by hubbie who hates shopping - well - you know how it is - fingers and phone been promised that one will try to get one in and ring me.

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Our biggest problem is shortage of doctors the ones we have are worked to death - cant get in for an appointment for around 3/4 weeks - rural area. Most of the people around here are over 50. Many retired here from mainland as houses were cheaper - still are a bit.

Yes Val I also take the Glucosamine --and have been for years now--did you say they said it was dangerous ? or did I get that wrong ?



Have you had your back check out--I thought mione was the hip area but all proved to be fine there but I have fractures of the spine.





I know what you mean about everything being about the almighty $ these days--:(



Yes Dr s the same here they can't get you out qick enough--once you do get into see them--seems to be allowed about 10 min at the longest..



Yes I see what you mean as far as natural meds go--I can also remember when they never liked Acuputure either--but sometimes that can do heaps of good.



For the cramps do try what I said --about the Camphor in the bed under the bottom sheet it really does help--and also the mixture--if you get one through the day-->>>see below

cut some lemons and cover them with Metho--leave for 2 weeks then take out the lemons and squeeze the remaining juice into the metho--(Throw the lemon skins aaway) keep this on hand and if you get a cramp put some on the area and the cramp is Gone.

The major problems, as I see them, for myself, are the eyes and ears. I've tried the generics, but they do not seem to work as well as the well known, tried and tested, brands. So, of course, I pay the extra, every month, just to have the one's that really do work for me. Generics in some cases may work as well, but if I become blind and deaf, just to save a dollar, it is not worth it for me.

Plan B - glucosamine is a natural medicine made from shellfish and safe to take as long as you can eat them.



I take Sea Tone which is green lipped mussel extract and glucosamine in its natural state. Works well for me better than other other and I have tried a lot. I took Sea tone all through the 80s up to 2003 when I moved to Tassie and then suddenly it wasn't in the shops - told it was not longer available* and like an idiot believed it. Cole's sold it and so did health stores so checked all said same. Then recently on telly saw Mobicosa which is also made from NZ green lipped mussels and costs a lot more but I then googled and found it and kicked myself for not doing it before. Buy it from Chemist Warehouse through their epharmacy on line for $14.99 for 125 capsules whereas Mobicosa is $40 for 80 capsules although theirs are 500g whereas Sea Tone are smaller 230g. difference Sea tone is less refined but no advertising.



* Since discovered that they tell porkies in shops in Tassie always say no longer no market or it doesn't sell and then find they never tried selling it in the first place - treat us like mushrooms :) Not used to that so took me a while to realise they lie.

Bev - I have ointment for ears - Kenacomb Otic and it has a levy on it too because of generics. One Pharmacist gave me a re-badged one called Otocomb Otic made by same company as Kenacomb Bristol Myers Squibb - worked for me and no levy.

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I did write to the company and they confirmed it was their own under a new name to thwart the generic companies.

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Quite a few do this so you can always write or email if you have their email address but I find it easier to write to address on box and ask - do you do a re-badge.

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I really am annoyed we have been put into this position as it is so stupid to go to third world meds to save very little really as the generics price theirs just under the original but make heaps more as they never had to do the research and development costs for years to get it on market.

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Also many doctors now say it is not working as well so if it doesn't - costs more in the long run as they have to treat it twice or even three times before finding out it was substituted cheaper meds that were not working and what he prescribed wasn't what was issued even if patient in ignorance and to save a bit of money said yes - silly and lacking in common sense on behalf of the bureaucrats but then who said they have ever shown that common sense was part of their make up? :) :)



Cant help but kick in the cynical me that says that all these companies pay donations to political parties and then get favours. So when this happens - generics that are NOT the same and only carry the active ingredient which has not got to be first class either get past the goal posts and we all pay through taxes - I think just another plank in the corruption creeping into this country and others too when we used to be able to laugh at the third world with their corruption because we didn't have it at home. Sad - greed has destroyed our way of life and taken trust out of the picture.

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All of these donations and lobbying came from America and so did the greed as we have just recently found out and even those with their heads in the sand have to come to realize that the world is no longer a nice place where everyone plays fair. Blame Gordon Gecko but he just expressed all that was going on and it took the world 20 years to find out it wasn't just in the movie.

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so Bev glad to see you are taking care of that body God issued you with because if you don't - who else will?

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Plan B said [ quote]Have you had your back check out--I thought mine was the hip area but all proved to be fine there but I have fractures of the spine.



Not since I left the Army. I had a slipped disc then but on my [b]right side[/b] and the doc said I could get a pension if later as he thought it may play up but although it did - not in a wheel chair and due to Sea Tone which I took back then in the 1980 when it first started playing me up and since then it has been quiet as a mouse.



[b]Left leg[/b] so not that - maybe hip but I do hope not as down here a 2 year plus waiting list for elective surgery and even then can be called and put back because a footballer has done in his knee and bumped or some such either way you lose your place in the queue.

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Blooming heck I thought when I heard this from neighbour who has waited now for 2.1/2 years and been bumped twice. Thought they all carried private health insurance these days - should they get paid enough if professional but it seems our Public hospitals also take in private patients anyway so we cant win unless we can afford private health and not many OAPs like this lady can.

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I cannot breathe if I take the glucosamine from shell fish so I buy the

Vegetarian one.

I have had a pain in the right thigh for many years and been to Doctors and Physios. and

x-rays and tried this and that and yes I take Magnesium every day but the pain still starts when I lay down but if my migraines have been bad and I take 3 forte during the day I have no pain but the restless legs and thigh pain starts if I have a milder headache and just one forte for the day - it's a vicious circle but what can we do? just do the best we can I suppose. We seem to

all have our crosses to bear but it gets annoying to say the least :(

Like the battery ads. say we have to keep on keeping on.....

All the best

Phyl.

Blooming heck Phyl that is not cheery to hear you have had pain in the thigh for years and not relief:(

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By vegetarian glucosamine I take it yours has bovine glucosamine in it then?

I know it sure enough is a pain in the proverbial well right thigh anyway :( :(

I have had the pain and restless legs for ten years.............Unless I have three Panadene

Forte in the 24 hours I am up shaking my leg at least 4 times at night.

I want to get off HRT and Codeine but completely unable! so I live with both

as my saviours.



The glucosamine I take is Golden Glow 750mg "Non animal in any way"!

Aspergillus niger which appears to me to be a fungus of some type

oops that's a bit of a worry but hey so are mushrooms and at least

I have no ill effects I am aware of from taking it.

All the best

Phyl.

Val it could be the nerves getting pinched in your back causing the leg to be painful--same with you Phyl

Had many back tests Jane and all seems o.k. albeit a nerve is very hard to detect. I hang upside down

every morn. as I have said and my back seems fine and in fact so is my leg until I have been in bed maybe

1/2 an hour when the restless legs and thigh pain sets in and then I get up and shake the leg and go

back to sleep for an hour or two and it starts again unless I have had a migraine for the day whereby

unlike most days when the head is a 5-6 and not a 9-10 or more I take 2 forte or 3 or more and that is the

deciding factor whether I wake intermittently all night.

Weird I know.

Phyl. loving life regardless.........

My problen showed up on Xray and then an MRI--showed where the nerves are being pinched--suppse to have Op' but with the hospitals in such a bad way--not game

Plan B and Phyl - I have wonder if this is a nerve being pinched along with bone cancer and all that sort of scary stuff that occurs to you and isn't there always a story on TV that week about someone with similar pain and very sick. :( It really is a wonder we are not all raving hypochondriacs. :) she said rolling on the floor laughing.

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Just have to wait and see.

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I am taking only 1 at night to get to sleep along with 1 panadeine which has 8 mg so get 38mg and that is just enough. Scared to take more as you can only take 8 a day max. have to take another 1 + 1 by 2am and then stick it out or get up around 5.30am. usually stick it out tossing and turning.

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I did notice on these last ones that they say it is the paracetamol that is the problem not the codeine.

Unless I read it wrong - bit of a surprise since they hand out Panamax by the 300 a script and 5 repeats!!!!!!!!

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