Gender pay gap

This has been raised once again and I feel it's time to have a close look at what exactly constitutes a gender pay gap. We keep getting percentages thrown up which claim that women are paid less than men and the inference is that women are being discriminated against.

The first thing that I feel is necessary is to examine the method of calculating the gender pay gap. Before any calculations are made, public servants are excluded. Why 16% of the workforce are excluded is not explained. Next, casual workers are included with their income being extrapolated to create a weekly rate. Then all of the income earned by women and men are averaged from tax returns and that shows that women earn less than men. I note that averaging a weekly wage from annual tax returns is considered illegal when used to recover overpayments for welfare recipients.

I see flaws in this method. Casual workers are generally low paid workers so including them as fulltime workers must skew the final result. 72.7% of women work in clerical and administrative, 70.3% of women work in community and personal service. 89.3% of men work as machinery operators and drivers, 83.8% of men are technicians and trades workers. All of these occupations are necessary and worthy but there has always been a disparity between clerks and tradespeople.

The only true test of a gender pay gap is when each and every occupation is comprised of 50% male and 50% female. The ACTU has expressed a desire to have a 50/50 participation in the trades but refuses to look at nursing (92.1% female) and teaching (73.8% female). Obviously we can never expect a 50/50 equality in occupations so why do we accept that there is a gender pay gap when the method of calculation is not comparing like with like.

7 comments

The number of men in teaching has gone down over the last decade or so. Not because men have less desire to go into teaching, but because men don't stand a chance against vexatious claims of inappropriate behaviour. Likewise with kindy teachers, child care and nursing. Men simply cannot risk their reputations on spurious allegations that don't even need to be proven. After all women/girls must be believed unconditionally regardless of truth or circumstances - right!

And before the haters start, no I am not defending real sex offenders or child abusers. But those labels do NOT belong on the vast majority of men. It is disgraceful that men have to be very careful in all situations for no other reason than they identify as male.

And they are further persecuted because they have more 'super' than women or earn more albeit in completely different occupations. I am sick of hearing how hard done by women are. For the last 20 years at least girls have had far more advantages in education than boys. So much so girls do better in school and outnumber boys in tertiary education. If these well-educated women cannot negotiate their own salaries maybe they shouldn't be in those jobs. And if they are not in a position to negotiate it's because they are on an industry reward and those are not gender-based! They are set by the UNIONS!

Totally agree KSS

The gender pay gap has always been shown in a slanted way, superannuation is based on a life time contribution, so it's naturally going to show a difference, due to the fact women take time off to have children, men can't bear children so unless we come up with another way to procreate, the system can't change, some people think women should be compensated and their super balances should be added to  by the government or their employer, that would discriminate against men, it would also discriminate against women who choose to stay home and raise their families, so how do we rectify the system so everyone is treated fairly? So generally stating that women are paid less is very misleading, women teachers get paid the same as men, women nurses get paid the same as men, women engineers get paid the same as men, so if any of the women in those industries get their super topped up they are in fact being paid more than their male counterparts, this applies to any other industry that employs both men and women. I think any unfairness might come from instances where divorce comes into the equation, I don't know how those situations are handled, but both sides should be treated equally, men and women move on in their lives some remarry others don't, I'm not sure we can solve all situations.

The simple answer to this is EQUAL pay for EQUAL work!

There is little of this happening because women in general do not have the physical ability to do most 'male' type jobs! 

Nor do they have the mental/logical ability in many cases, also.

And if women choose to take time from work to raise children, maybe they should have planned for this financially and added more to super before and after time off rather than whinge about not having enough to retire on.

Working husbands could supply funds for that purpose if the couple so choose.

Single mothers have no-one to blame but themselves!

 

The simple answer to this is EQUAL pay for EQUAL work!    I agree

There is little of this happening because women in general do not have the physical ability to do most 'male' type jobs!   Sometimes NOT always

Nor do they have the mental/logical ability in many cases, also.  UTTER RUBBISH

And if women choose to take time from work to raise children, maybe they should have planned for this financially and added more to super before and after time off rather than whinge about not having enough to retire on.  MANY TIMES MEN ALSO WANT A FAMILY

Working husbands could supply funds for that purpose if the couple so choose. WOMEN ALSO DO A HELL OF A LOT OF HOUSEWORK

Single mothers have no-one to blame but themselves!  I AGREE 100%

 

When I worked for the Commonwealth Bank in the 1960s-70s, they had 'male' and 'female' designated jobs, due to the standard of expertise needed to perform them.

After a few years work on 'female' wage/job I was transferred to the 'male' wage/job, as I had the ability to do what was required. This may not work in all situations, but worked then - and no-one complained, just did their jobs and earned the money for that job.

Maybe some women should have got higher education so they can earn the $$ they demand!

There are no longer male/female designated jobs in any industry. It would result in near anarchy should anyone attempt to bar one gender or the other from a role purely on gender grounds!

I can't believe some of these answers. Posters use pseudonyms that are gender free but reading some of the comments tell me who the men are. I thought the original post had some logic yet the answers are saying that women have only themselves to blame as they are less educated than men, not able to handle logic, young women don't have the foresight to add super to their fund for when they are retired and worst of all, the discrimination against single mothers. No wonder us women get upset with some men.

I agree with most of your comments, but men also have the right to get upset with some women. I am a male and I fully appreciate the work that my wife has done for the 53 years we have been married, she was never in paid employment but spent most of that time doing voluntary work and raising our children and did a fantastic job, some of the comments regarding women's ability are way off the mark, intelligence isn't decided by gender, a good balance in the workforce reaps the best rewards.

Sue Ridge, if you read my 2nd comment you would fully understand that I am female, having worked a 'female' job in the CBA but was transferred to a 'male' job & wage.

And how do we know you are female, just because you call yourself 'Sue'?

Johnny Cash sang a song called 'A Boy Named Sue' back in 1969!

 

Well the reason most women can not accept the inputs above is that the inputs reflect the other side of the story. Men, (white men) mostly , are over being totally divided and excluded from everyday Society. Most of the comments above are totally reflective of a Society that only addresses 52% of Society and excludes the other 48%. The deliberate favour towards girls in education, by re-arranging curriculums to favour girls is deplorable and inventing some terminologies like STEM to be a cover sheet for endorsing discriminatory behaviour . Girls end up with a 60% to 40% domination of entrance to University. And totally, there is absolutely zero attention to career directions dominated by women, such as in the teaching, nursing, and public service.

Women of today wish to desecrate the inputs of their fathers and grandfathers, like my father, who worked 7 days a week for 12 years and 6.5 days for another five years ALL for the purpose of providing the funding for the family. My mother did not work but cared for the children. Some how this is described as discrimination by the men towards women in the past.

Most of the action taken is initiated by active females addiction driven hatred of men. And I can confirm that teaching is wary for men in the case of litegation and accusations with no penalty for making unproven and false allegations. Another sure way of a female eliminating any male  to a job promotion is a sexual harrassment claim. A female success of gaining promotion under these tactics is a formality.

We can also ask whether 103,000 losses of male deaths to 600 female deaths within our armed services in WW1 and WW2 is discriminatory. Then there whether 41 deaths in battle to zero female deaths in the battle in Afghanastan is acceptable. Or whether the 1960/70s conscription of 19 years  old males, and no females, is acceptable.

Probably the worst aspect is that young girls, for say three generations, have been indoctrinated into the framework of thought that presents our current ideologies.

 

   

   

Yes agree with most of your comments, to give an example of how young fella's feel nowadays, my grandson who has just completed a double degree in law, political science and economics went for an interview, there was a young lass applying for the same job, I don't know her background, she may have been eminently more qualified than my grandson, but he immediately thought that he had no chance of getting the position, this is not the fault of the young lass, but it is an indication of how young men think they are at a disadvantage when applying for jobs, my grandson had extremely high marks but he didn't get a call back, there may be many reasons that he didn't get considered for the position, the fact remains that he is convinced that he was the wrong gender, is this a sign of the times?

Well said, Woodstock!

Most women don't realise/understand that quotas are the biggest insult to themselves and it is mind-bogglingly stupid to demand them.

What quotas are actually saying is that women don't have the intelligence/ability/skills/nous, etc to get particular jobs/positions on their own merit, so 50% [or more] of those jobs/positions MUST be allocated to females. Equality is considered more important than ability!

Also, women tend to choose jobs that are less physically demanding, e.g. we don't see many council road-workers wielding a shovel, do we!

Same principle applies to elected officials! For instance, in 1994 the ALP mandated 35% preselection quota for women in WINNABLE seats by 2002, since increased to 50% by 2025.

BUT... WE WERE WARNED THIS WOULD HAPPEN!!! Isaiah 3:12 ...children are their oppressors, women rule over them... your leaders are leading you astray...

Well Jim my grandson, as well like all others, has been subject to infant, primary, and secondary education under a female domination flag. Absolutely like all boys subject to domination by female teachers and students. Girls certainly know by the time of their University entrance domination, are indoctrinated that they as females are the ones with power. And with zero accountability. Boys are also fully aware of their subjective and submissive identity. Try this. I think the boys after 14 years of pre Uni submissive identity, based on gender, contributes heavily to youths and young men's anti Social activity and unlawful transgressions as they develop.  Picked on as young kids, in a kidnapped education framework, they are tormented by their lack of capacity to handle their subjective Social identity of the subjective male.

An animal experiment would indicate the same or similar outcome

 

                                                             "IT'S ABOUT TIME"

I have just read that for the first time in History Paralympians will get equal pay as the Olympians. Gold $20,000 - Silver $15,000, and Bronze $10,000.  Surely these people deserved to get some recognition in years gone by?  I have been reading about how some of them have had to put up with tormenting by others when they were young, and others saying they couldn't do it.  With guts and determination they have proved all of them wrong.  I salute each and every one of them, winners and those that didn't win, you are indeed the true Olympians. , 

 

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