"Most will be up in arms over my comments about our voters"



I certainly am not up in arms.

The rot with brainwashing voters commenced with Gough Whitlam, when he changed the voting age to 18. We now have a generation of voters , "educated" in the Labor State system.

Here in Victoria, Joan Kirner got rid of any semblance of encouraging excellence and competition, both as education minister and Premier.

While at the same time, between her and John Cain, ran the State into the ground.

Jeff Kennettdid his best to turn things around, which he did with the economy, but the rot in the school system was too deep, aided and abetted by the teachers' union.

So gradually, State by State, they have "re-educated" our young people.

These are the voters who in great part got Labor over the line, and will probably at the next Fed election, because there is very little individuality in the thinking.

Re stuff like the Gay Mardi gras.

Traditional religious and moral values are passe, and it is fine to applaud such events as the GMG, where they mock nuns and the Pope.......but say a word against man-made Global Warming and you are denounced as a heretic.

This is the mentality that continues to vote Labor, and will probably continue to do so, because the brainwashing is too deep.



I couldn't agree more with you Innes, and once again I applaud you for speaking out.

The problem with Australia is that the major parties corrupted the Westminster system to suit their own agenda - that one of them is always in power and the other in opposition.

Where the system still works in the UK - you have 3 parties - Labour Conservative and Lib Democrat as well as other smaller parties or independents.



They made voting compulsory as this gets the donkey voters out and they dont seem to have any idea so follow what the media tell them or a how to vote card that they think is for them. Mainly they vote Labor never once waking up to the fact that Labor deserted the working man and the battler back in the 80's got into bed with big business and the proof of that pudding is wages held back under The Accord, Hawke and Keating both left millionaires and not from the parliamentary salaries and not because of any other source other than being in bed with big business - work that out - tips on shares etc I reckon.

But every now and then the swinging voter gets the Liberals in as the pattern is change the government instead of thinking what you need from them - again a media driven idea.

Young generation and look what that did for the Yanks - Monica and Marilyn and Democrats are labor.

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Then they made it that to get a seat you have to have 50% of the vote and then they brought in preference voting for when the 50% failed, which is corruption because candidates trade preferences for favours and this ensure that one of the majors will win most seats and history proves it.



Left will tell you that first past the post means the seat may be won by an unpopular candidate - lot of baloney as usual from them - democracy in action is the one with the majority of votes wins not second or even third votes needed to get in one of the majors like Libs ior Labs.

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so [b]we do not have a democratic one man one vote one value at all [/b]because that just may lead to another party like One nation getting a foothold in the door - and they did that party in good and proper as you know.

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So no I will not take you up on the bet as I have very little faith that many Aussies can - any longer think for themselves - hence the popularity of thousands watching someone pick their nose whilst sitting on the toilet instead of getting a life for themselves. rofl - I mean then there are the other reality shows which are in fact cheap telly.

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We are stuck with it as we although there are two of us - cant afford Pay TV like so many others around us in public housing - count the dishes as we still pay a mortgage as well rates oh and '[b]we cannot afford steak - mince from Cole's when it is $4.99 kg and any other large discounts usually lamb forequarter chops for him as I cant eat it anyway - lost too many teeth waiting 8 years for my appointment with dentist but never steak[b]

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Glad you can afford to drink spirits - must be either $45 better off a week on full pension or have another source of income - we dont. Our pension fund went down the gurgler before every man and his dog got covered by John Howard after his brother and Ansett. Blimey dont even know the price of a coffee out as not in the budget - home made is cheaper.

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Not bitter but I still would like to know why I paid single rate of income tax for years only to be told I am worth $90 a fortnight less value because of my marital status. And this is just a rotten bureaucratic stuff up on putting up pensions every six months by percentages.

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Gap gets wider and wider - originally singles got the same as marrieds but then got an extra $15 a week plus of course the extra for rent allowances etc and if public housing charges more than 20% of income in rent they are doing the wrong thing.

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Again a purely slow thought or no thought pattern as someone should have picked up on this but these days public service has no exam to get in and does not attract the best and brightest pay is too low - but then so few bright ones left here - off in London working for huge salary packages and being appreciated for their brightness and willingness to work.

It is usual now for public housing to charge 25% of income, including any money earning interest in the bank (25% of that as well). Plus they now have to pay for every drop of water used - no freebies. Do you have a thing about public housing tenants? Most now are people who have a disability, which prevents them from working full time, or are aged pensioners - be it married or single. At least that is the way it is in NSW

Big Val

1.If we had a one vote one value system in Australia at the General Elections labour would always win hands down by about 20% every time (abs Figs).

2. Currently we have five parties and various independents to choose from when voting.

That is why the (2 parties) National and Liberal form a coalition to get their numbers up against the labour voting block and become in this case the opposition.

3 Our democracy is alive and well and you can get rid of Rudd inc at the next Fed election if you get sufficient numbers.

4 Lucky that we are in a Democracy as all those emails that are sent to our politicians,would in a great number of other countries place the senders on a watch list and they might even disappear.



Hang on for the ride as we all have a long way to go to the next election and as they say a week in Politics is a long time so we will get quite a show.

WOW BigVal, I am not taking you on anymore. How spot on!!! It looks like I will have to wait for Clay to return from church, before I can place a bet. I do earn a little extra, plus I never play the pokies & I only buy my Turkey on discount at $32 or home brew, around $5

BevG. Public housing is another example of the big lies, in NSW. Most public housing tenants, who are working, can rent on the open market, better, cheaper & in better areas, than the Housing Commission offers with the 25% deal. A final point that few are aware of. If you borrow money to buy shares, you are deemed to earn income on your falling investment, BUT the interest on the borrowings is NOT deductable from your deemed income!!!!

WOW BigVal, I am not taking you on anymore. How spot on!!! It looks like I will have to wait for Clay to return from church, before I can place a bet. I do earn a little extra, plus I never play the pokies & I only buy my Turkey on discount at $32 or home brew, around $5

BevG. Public housing is another example of the big lies, in NSW. Most public housing tenants, who are working, can rent on the open market, better, cheaper & in better areas, than the Housing Commission offers with the 25% deal. A final point that few are aware of. If you borrow money to buy shares, you are deemed to earn income on your falling investment, BUT the interest on the borrowings is NOT deductable from your deemed income!!!!





I am back ...........now what were you saying old chap..............



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welcome back Clay. At around 10 PM last night you made a point of not challenging my statement, which was an offer of a bet, not a statement. I answered the non challenge anyway & am now waiting for you to take up this wonderful opportunity to not only prove that I haven't got a clue & at the same time get to drink some of that magnificent Barossa red, at my expense.

[size=4] well Clay, Like most punters, I don’t have to base my bets on fact. [/size]



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I asked for fact but all you gave me was opinion ............which makes any sort of sensible debate rather poitless you would agree



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you are right Clay, so lets get on with the bet.

PS If you go back to my reply to your post, I think I left you enough openings to carry on with a discussion. I could only offer fact rather than opinion, if the election had already been held. At the risk of being pedantic, it is not possible to debate fact, only opinion !!!!!

You are spoiling for a fight I can see ...............If you join this group they will accommodate you with ease ..............but beware they play rough and I wonder can you handle it



http://www.debaterelate.com/phpBB2/index.php



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Who ME ???? NEVER !!!!! I am only a little guy & a self proclaimed pussy cat. Having said that, I remember that I share my home with a wife, Psych student, IQ around 140 & a typical smart ass 19 YO grand daughter!!!! & you think you can scare me. Why do you think I got on here? It's the only place I can get a word in.

Could I also say that any single person - in public housing in NSW - if they earn over $360 - including their pension, now pays 30% of their total gross weekly income? That's only $90 per week, above the pension. Not a fortune and they are mostly on "reduced" incomes, because of the disability "awards". They may well work 20 hours to earn that.

You are spoiling for a fight I can see ...............If you join this group they will accommodate you with ease ..............but beware they play rough and I wonder can you handle it



http://www.debaterelate.com/phpBB2/index.php



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Yep they sure do. rofl