it amazes me to observe the irrational fear with which some people regard the small number of asylum seekers coming to australia.



i remember the press using similar fear tactics when we were invading vietnam and consequently received some of their "boat" people. has our country suffered any adverse effects from these refugees settling here? of course not - quite the contrary.



my concern is for the very high number of IMMIGRANTS (not refugees) we lure into this country each year - now more than half a million. i do not care which countries they are from, my concern is for the sustainability of this country. we are mostly desert, we have poor soil, scarce clean water, our poor environment is hugely polluted, and we are (in my opinion), already over populated with human beings.



i would like to see our annual intake of genuine refugees increased to, say 20,000 per year (they make wonderful citizens for the most part), and our immigration intake reduced to something like 10,000 people per year. an annual intake of about 30,000 people.



i am not at all racist. i do believe in sustainability in every sense of the word.

Kika, speaking only for myself, I don't post on this topic out of fear. My objections relate to the hypocrisy and ineptness of this Govt who, when Howard was PM, described Christmas Island as a white elephant.

Julia Gillard is on public record as saying, in 2003, "another boat, another policy failure."



This is from The Australian newspaper nov 23, 2007.

KEVIN Rudd has taken a tough line on border security, warning that a Labor government will turn the boats back and deter asylum-seekers, using the threat of detention and the nation's close ties with Indonesia.



In an interview with The Australian, the Opposition Leader advocated a layered approach to border security based on "effective laws, effective detention arrangements, effective deterrent posture vis-a-vis vessels approaching Australian waters".



Sheer hypocrisy.









They have now got the cheek to put out the welcome mat, unload unlimited numbers of boat people, spend hundreds of thousands of $$$$ on them, while we have people sleeping under bridges, or if lucky in a car....which points to another hypocrisy of Rudd's...homelessness to be halved. If there was some sort of order , strict regulation and process, and Rudd had spent time and money on the above, rather than swanning around the world bignoting, we would probably not be having this discussion, I believe.



Immigrants built this country. I come from a family of immigrants. No reasonable person I know, is against immigration. But it has to be organised in an orderly fashion.



We don't know how many people have drowned trying to get here since Rudd softened the line on borders. I've read one figure of 179....they're only the ones known!



And yes, because of the sloppiness of the way this is being handled, there is the possibility of unwanted types slipping through the cracks.

How come those people rescued by that ship..can't think of the name...were given preferential treatment.

I'm afraid Rudd gives me the impression he's way out of his depth, and has no idea what he's doing....more's the pity for this country.

Some time ago I posted a link explaining that, by percentage, more illegals are arriving here than anywhere else...[i]by percentage[/i].

fwed, I don't have to follow your instructions, but

DIAC spokesman Sandi Logan said adults in community detention were

given $100 cash and $360 in store credit, which can be used at one of

two local stores, a fortnight to buy food and other items.

As I stated quite clearly earlier, this is NOT paid by Centerlink. It is paid

directly by DIAC. I realise that it is a little hard for you to comprehend, BUT

DIAC is NOT Centerlink & is NOT related to Centerlink in any way.

You then state:-

BigVal has been making wrong statements that they get 89% of newstart

from the day they arrive on Christmas Is. That is BS and I think you know that.

Then 3 lines later you state:-

Asylum Seeker Assistance Scheme payments to eligible asylum seekers

and allowances paid to people in community detention on Christmas Island

are paid 89 per cent of the Centrelink Newstart allowance.

I wish you would make up your mind. You state that BigVal is wrong & the

correct payment is what BigVal said. Derrrrrrrr!!!

I presume from the apology that you did not make that you have found out

that your pension IS taxable.

What has any of my figures got to do with the Canadian hoax?

Every time I submit anything on here, you say it is wrong.

What have I said that is wrong?

Fwed - you really are a cantankerous old man who disbelieves anyone who is not a ruddite.



Here is the original source once again of what the illegals get paid on arrival on Christmas Island.





18 May 2009



The Department of Immigration and Citizenship (DIAC) has refuted false claims circulating on the internet that asylum seekers on Christmas Island and refugees permanently settling in Australia receive more in benefit payments than Australian pensioners.



“The figures quoted in the email bear no resemblance to income-support payments to pensioners, or to payments to asylum seekers and refugees settling in Australia,” DIAC spokesman Sandi Logan said today.



“The text and figures in the email appear to have originated in Canadian emails, websites and internet chatrooms. We suspect that the email circulating here has been cut and pasted from these sources.



[b]“Asylum seekers in Australia who have not yet had their protection claims decided have no access to Centrelink benefits.



[b][size=4]“Asylum Seeker Assistance Scheme payments to eligible asylum seekers and allowances paid to people in community detention on Christmas Island are the same rate – 89 per cent of Centrelink Newstart allowance.[/size]



“In Australia, refugees granted permanent visas may gain access to benefits on the same basis and at the same rates as other Australian permanent residents.



“There is no separate rate of benefit payments for refugees.”[/b]



Mr Logan said refugees received no cash payments under Australia’s Integrated Humanitarian Settlement Strategy.



“DIAC helps eligible refugees with English-language lessons and settling-in assistance including basic goods to start a household, subsidies for rent and utilities for their first four weeks in the country,” he said.



“We would strongly encourage anyone who receives an email claiming asylum seekers or refugees are treated more favourably than Australian permanent residents to hit the delete button and ignore these scurrilous claims.”



Media Enquiries: National Communications (02) 6264 2244



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DIAC Home | RSS | Privacy | Copyright and Disclaimer | Pandora Archive

Minister for Immigration and Citizenship | Parlimentary Secretary for Multicultural Affairs and Settlement Services

http://www.newsroom.immi.gov.au/media_releases/714



Now please all take note Fwed does not cut and paste anything to his data or would not be always saying it is not true or casting doubts on people who do.



I do keep data with references.

This is the policy currently from the Liberal Party on arrivals into this country.



Libs insist refugees work for their keep

May 27, 2010 1:07AM





REFUGEES would be forced to work for their welfare benefits and may only be permitted to stay in Australia for as little as six months under a tough new border security policy to be announced by the Coalition today.



In an attempt to capitalise on rising community anger at the continued flow of boats that have brought 2805 asylum-seekers to Australia so far this year, the Coalition will unveil a suite of measures designed to harden its border security credentials.



At the heart of those measures is a new, tougher class of temporary protection visa to be issued to all unauthorised asylum-seekers.



In echoes of the Howard government's Pacific Solution, the Coalition is expected to announce new measures to process asylum-seekers offshore.



The Coalition will also flag its intention to dump the suspension of new refugee claims for Afghan and Sri Lankan asylum-seekers, which was unveiled by the Federal Government in April.



The suspension freezes new Sri Lankan asylum claims for three months and new Afghan claims for six months.



Opposition immigration spokesman Scott Morrison told The Australian that abolishing the suspension would restore the non-discriminatory tenets of Australian asylum-seeker policy.



"We have tough policies but they are applied equally to everyone," Mr Morrison said.



"We have a clear view that people who arrive illegally will get different treatment to those who arrive legally.



"We don't seek to hide the fact what we are trying to do is ensure there is a different outcome for those who come illegally and those who don't."



The new announcements are designed to silence Coalition critics who for months have accused the opposition of failing to provide convincing alternative policies to stop the rising number of boats.



They are also an attempt to capitalise on growing disquiet in marginal electorates in the months leading up to this year's Federal Election.



Mr Morrison yesterday defended the proposed temporary protection visa, saying it was a fairer, more versatile method of providing protection.



"Refugee status is not a permanent condition and you need a policy to reflect that," he said.



[url=http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/money/money-matters/libs-insist-refugees-work-for-their-keep/story-fn300aev-1225871804043]Libs- insist-refugees- work for- their- keep[/url]



This is back to what was a far better solution to those jumping the queues and pushing back patient people waiting in camps with no money to pay boat people $19,000Au approx a ticket and whose claims are already accessed.



Instead of improving immigration Rudd has made it a lot worse and seems incapable of stopping the boats because it would mean adopting the Coalitions policies and that wont do will it?

Koko - excellent reply to Kika and I am a realist not a racist - I have no objection to any arrivals that are legal.



I object to queue jumpers and those who arrive and make no bones that they are here to take over the country once they get the numbers and meanwhile will not assimilate.



That is not what immigration is about, it is for a better life and to live like the people whom you are joining - not changing their ways to your ways you left behind because of no welfare cheques which may be cynical but when certain people pass through safe countries which practise their culture but have no welfare and head here - one has to take it as read.



And yes Kika we too are concerned that Australia is overpopulated for its water resources which is showing up and urgently needing attention instead we have brought in 1.1/2 million+ over the last 2 years in all categories of arrivals - starving the farmers of water to grow food and the rivers and wetlands of water to sustain the flora and fauna.



The government is hiding its head in the sand of getting re-elected rather than governing for the Australian people and future Australians with our birth rate now well up. Not sure the other parties are any better.



40% of our population increase are in country births, so we can stop the baby bonus no longer short of babies and also should give our 12 months notice to the UN that we will not take any more refugees under their 1967 protocol which allows anyone in passing through safe countries when original 1951 its added to did not - and is the pull factor to boat people as we are the only ones in the southern hemisphere.

We pay Indonesia money to keep these people up there and pay their rent via Migration Organisation. Plus pay for detention centres. Plus pay 750 million here in Oz to run 10 detention centres. Money which would be better spent on Aussies here for hospital dental and other services and affordable housing.



Then we can take in whom we want when we want and still bring in refugees we want - although for our resources we have taken more than any other country to date so no one can accuse us of not being compassionate or of racism.

Asylum Seeker Assistance Scheme payments to [b]eligible[/b] asylum seekers and allowances paid to people in community detention on Christmas Island are paid 89 per cent of the Centrelink Newstart allowance.



OK we all agree on that except innes got some stuff fom somewhere else.

The key word is eligable.

Not all are eligable so how can they be paid fom day 1.

No where does it say anything about day 1

I got my info from the government web site , not from some newspaper.

& No innes I did not apologize as I think you are a scaremonger.

Innes - thanks for reply - I am sure that the monies you refer to are the assistance and of course they are better off as their money is not used to pay for board and lodging but if we asked the authorities would say that the 11% not paid of the New start rate is for that. Ha Ha when we know that the cost of keeping one person on CI with all the necessary staff to run it has blown out any budget for the next 10 years and then some.



I just wonder how the store monies will go once they get here on the mainland.



Does anyone live in NT where it is operating and know how it goes and if it is being rorted as humans always seek ways to do so. But the idea of food and clothing for the kiddies is a good one and one that Howard was going to do but was ridiculed and now it is in operation on CI as well as NT and someone said in Qld.

Fwed do stop being picky [b]illegal arrivals are eligible once they rock up on CI and get paid immediately[/b].



They are not eligible for Centrelink payments as these are paid to permanent residents or citizens but this is a scheme for arrivals waiting for processing and which takes as long or longer under Rudd than the previous administration seemingly.



also that is a government press release to the newspapers not a newspaper report as you assume.



You are still being cantankerous on this issue of course they pay them straight away as it is taking months rather than weeks to process these people who have no identification papers as they burn them to gain refugee status when not actually refugees in most cases but economic migrants in search of a better life in a country which has a good welfare system - which is why Britain is also target in the northern hemisphere.



The question should be what happens if they find one not to be a refugee but this is rare as under the 1967 protocol which is a lot easier to be gain refugee status.

BigVal would you please ask that half wit if his pension is taxable,

like all other aged pensions, or is he on a special dispensation?

You might also ask why he says quite clearly that you are wrong,

followed by a statement that what you said is wrong is actually right.

The detainees are eligible from arrival until processed & then lose DIAC

& put onto Newstart through Centerlink.

I have been searching through other Government papers & have

found that the CI detainees are also paid some medical etc, etc

allowances which bring their total payments, including store credits

up to the full new start amount. This means that they are actually

paid a lot more than New Start, because, apart from the payments,

they get free accommodation & food. After they are processed, they

are given a special one off payment to buy furniture etc to set up their

new home.

BigVal, the immigration figures that are often quoted are wrong. the actual

immigration numbers for 2009 - 2010 are only 168,700 on top of the

Humanitarian Program which is set at 13 750 places, giving a total of

182,450. These figures have been drastically reduced from 1st July

this year, with a number of categories, such as Chefs & hairdressers

being cancelled completely.

BTW BigVal, I have just found some Immigration papers that I brought home

some time ago, from the office. The number of settlers arriving in Australia

between July 2008 and June 2009 totalled 158 021. They came from more

than 200 countries. Most were born in New Zealand (16.2 percent), the United

Kingdom (13.63 percent), India (10.9 percent), China (10.0 percent) and South

Africa (4.5 percent). The major change, for that year was the massive drop in

UK numbers from 24,000+, down to 21,000+ & the movement of NZ numbers

from 4th place to an easy first with just under 26,000. These figures give

credence to the rumour that Sydney is New Zealand's 3rd largest City by

population. It is also interesting to note that the Chinese & Indian students

have fallen over 6,000 P/A & there has been a massive increase in these

student numbers accepted into the USA.

When I was over there last the waggish Kiwis were calling Australia, "the wist island of Noo Zulland." Cheeky sods.:-)

Innes. Stopping permanent residence being automatic if a student would dramatically take down the numbers once they barred them from taking hairdressing cooking and hospitality - stands to reason these trades are well catered for here and not a skill needed by big business either. So maybe that is why they are off to US of A!



All income including pensions are taxable above the tax free threshold and the only reason those on full age pension without any other income don't get taxed is that they make the single age pension the taxable threshold for pensioners.