While it is true that this work change was a genuine concession, if any pensioner starts to earn worthwhile sums they will be slugged harder than they were previously. – John Howard introduced a scheme whereby pensioner investments (bank deposits etc) would be deemed to earn stated rates of return which were related to the Reserve Bank cash rate. Back in July last year, pensioners' investments were deemed to have returned 2 per cent for the first $42,000 of investments and 3 per cent for any amount above that. If a pensioner earned 6 per cent on the assets then the extra amount above the deemed rate did not affect their pension. The government last March boosted the deeming rate by 50 per cent, from 2 to 3 per cent for the first $42,000 and from 3 to 4.5 per cent for anything above that. That means that whereas a single pensioner could have $137,066 in investments before those investments affected their pension, that level has been reduced to $96,044.

And of course the deeming effect is multiplied by the lift in the effective "tax" rate from 40 to 50 per cent. To keep their pension, a single pensioner must quickly spend $41,000. They can’t give it away. Many will lie about their spending and hide the money under the bed. It was clear that the savage nature of the changes would actually reduce pensions for many people, so a grandfather clause was inserted so no pension would be reduced by the lift in the effective pension tax and the other changes. But a large number of people have received no additional pension and many still need an even higher base pension before they are entitled to a rise in cash payments. I am not sure how many pensioners understand what is happening to them because all they hear from the government is that they are better off and the Opposition has not twigged to the effect of the structural changes.

Cont'd

If Tony Abbott wants the pensioner vote he should restore the traditional 167 per cent relationship between couples and single pensioners and restore the 40 per cent effective tax rate. Meanwhile, pensioner couples with their backs to the wall should consider going into a state of separation (it can be done) and limiting their earnings to $6500 a year or $125 a week. Any additional wages above $125 a week must be cash or they will be "taxed" at 50 per cent via pension reduction – the highest tax rate in the country. Yet that’s Australia 2010 style. The spin promises a benefit. Reality takes it away.





[url=http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/Pensions-tax-by-stealth-pd20100810-86SPN?opendocument&src;=rss]Source[/url]

Thanks for that article koko, it really is an "eye opener". It is plain to see that Labour has made much of their "big increases for pensioners" while being cunning in clawing some of it back. If it were a simple matter of voting for Abbot to reverse the situation, I would do so. I have seen all too often though that political parties can be scathingly critical of the actions of their foes, but when elected, they just leave the unpopular measures in place.

As we have seen, Abbot and the libs have not even offered to address these issues and have done virtually nothing to attract the "pensioner" vote.

On top of this disinterest from government, price increases in water, electricity, food etc all impact on pensioners and those on government benefits, so that when any increase is given, it is far too little and far too late.

Sure does seem Labour is the best bet at this time. I have friends been

on the Age pension a bit longer than us and all say they have

done better with Labour in office.

Yes thanks for that Koko--I will rpint that out and keep it--I was aware of most of it but not other bits

Thanks Koko - was plain on the face of it that couples in particular are being done down by Labor but you wont stop the idiots voting for them.



Look how many get caught time and time again putting money into scams where they are promised high interest returns only to cry to be compensated when they lose their savings.



Or answer these emails telling them they have won money in a lottery they never bought a ticket in and send off their $50 and the details of their bank accounts and then wonder why $50 is lost and even lose the money in their accounts at times.



No hope for some who just plain are dumb bunnies and most of these keep voting in the dumb bunnies of the ALP who cant manage our money as a nation time and time again to run up debt and deficits.



Happens all over the western world - Mensa said back 40 years ago the world was dumbing down and sure were proven right as the world keeps on doing stupid things to prove it like voting in people who historically cant manage money and this latest lot cant even manage a project without killing 4 people due to lack of training which Julia was in charge of and she was warned if it rolled out could lead to loss of life and it did. Makes me miss Paul Keating whose team couldn't manage the money but he could give us a laugh whilst he was running the country and didn't mess up anywhere near as bad as this current lot - no wonder he is saying so very little - embarrassed.







As for Abbott and the Coalition - the facts stated above that they did nothing for the age pensioner is as usual lies straight out of the Labor handbook of how to brain wash the punters silly enough to vote for them.



Howard tied the pension to the MAW which gave a rise bigger than that under the CPI which never ever kept up with cost of living as always adjusted downwards for other reasons like the 30% medical rebate.



Howard gave pensioners the $400 bonus as well as the original $100 Utilities Allowance making it $500 and Labor cant keep on lying saying their idea.



Howard gave the pensioners a GST allowance, Internet allowance on top of the Pharmaceutical Allowance but Labor voters like to forget this.





See Labor voters forgot that Howard also gave the carers a $1600 bonus which Rudd did drop off - not so lucky for carers.



Next time around age pensioners may not be the lucky ones as Ken Henry had his sights set on taking the base pension down to the dole for all on benefits and says age pensioners were cushioned by Howard and treated favourably.



Do not expect Julia to stand up for pensioners as she states she believes we should all work! Means she also sees anyone over the age of 65 as an non-productive unit.



Never happen I hear most of you Labor supporters say - but they have managed to cut the pension out from under you already have they not and not one of you noticed on here now did you - all dazzled by the spin.



Interesting times that will be ended on Saturday or Sunday at the latest.



One thing for sure Labor has already dudded the age pensioner most of whom who haven't read Koko's article she kindly posted here - just don't know yet.



Couples do and many are not going to vote Labor ever again but will it be enough?



BTW ACA tonight has a segment on couples divorcing on the pension.

That means that whereas a single pensioner could have $137,066 in investments before those investments affected their pension, that level has been reduced to $96,044.



Centrelink states that a single aged pensioner who owns their own home can have $181,750 in assets before the pension is affected.

I tried to find the sum of $96,044 at the centrelink site with no luck.

Maybe someone could help me find it and give a link.



It seems to me that the vocal liberal supporters may not be on the pension or at least not on the full pension.

toot2000 has mentioned before about which members of this forum are on the pension.

I would expect someone who was an accountant and worked as a property manager would have structured their finances in a way that they would not have to rely on the pension, particularly when that accountant / property manager did not know what the pension payment was and accused me of telling porkies when I stated the amount of pension I receive.



For the record I receive the full single pension.

I also have an small income from an annuity which is treated as an asset but not deemed to earn any income.

Sure does seem Labour is the best bet at this time. I have friends been

on the Age pension a bit longer than us and all say they have

done better with Labour in office.





A perfect example of what Big Val was describing

Whether any of us vote Labour, Liberal, Green or for the Sex party, I consider it rude, churlish and arrogant to refer to any voter or group of voters as "dumb" or "stupid".

We all have our opinions and beliefs and we take note of those policies, speeches, media reports etc that we choose to consider as credible. For those who show no respect for the opinions of others (whether or not you agree with them), you deserve no respect or recognition of your own opinions. We live in a democracy and whichever party wins the election, we will ALL be subject to their decisions.

It is becoming fashionable after elections to blame the "dumb and stupid" or the "donkey" voters and claim that the best party was unfairly defeated. I would hope that this is not the case for saturdays election. Voting is compulsory, so virtually EVERYBODY votes and the result will be the wish of the majority. SO, if your party loses, just suck it up and work for a different result in four years or so.

Suck it up indeed.



And don't bother to tell us about it if once more a reduction in the age pension is on the cards if Labor gets in as it will be.



Have to find the money for their promise to get back to surplus and they will cut benefits all down to one level as save a few billions as easy no one will care much as they didnt when the singles got $30 and the marrieds got nothing.



Still at last one journalist knows differently but they think they will never need the pension - so why worry.



Unlike the 90,000 new folk who lost their SFR status due to Bill Clinton (Labor) who thought gee nice if everyone could own their home and then sold the idea and that caused the crash of 2008



[b]We were so lucky because our banks were regulated not to do this by guess who The Coalition who are the only major party who can manage the money and are seen I am told in Canberra as the party of the elderly.Which may explain Julia not wanting to give the elderly a rise and why she wont hesitate to lower the pension.[/b]





Nasty habit of repeating their own promises and breaking them again this lot.

Oh Fwed you really are a Labor voter and fit the stereotype to a T.



Of course you wont find the figure quoted by the article on the Centrelink website it only states what is allowed in assets.



what was described is how those assets are treated when Centrelink applies the deeming rate/s and which you will not discover unless you have income derived from these assets treated.



Yes I did know how it was being shifted downward but as you don't believe anything other than a website written by the very government who are ripping off the pensioner why would I waste my time yet again.



and yes it was a fellow accountant who finally got someone to listen to what I and others had been saying for some time.



As to anyone's personal circumstances up to them to post it or not. I prefer not.



But do come across many who did had very good retirement plans - 90,000 following in the wake of the onslaught of the GFC now take the age pension, full or part, last time I was able to see the figure.



See no matter how hard the left try we are not all blessed with the exact same intelligence quotient.



Everyone has a talent for something and it is up to the teachers of the world to try to bring this out for every individual but these days of pc and crowded classrooms even the very best teacher has just not got the time.



Labor from the 80's set a trend for all to go to Uni and get a degree but that left us short of skilled trades and this has been neglected but Howard did start building Technical colleges to teach trades as they did back in the UK 50 years ago. Rudd cancelled these and withdrew funding from the ones built and running here in Tassie and it was the Catholic Dioceses who took over the funding thankfully for the students whom Labor would have left standing without a trade school.



Now they propose to build more trade schools(Tech colleges) but different ha ha have to be different or may be likened to the Coalition pity always worse financially under being different as best way taken by a good at money managing Coalition - and the idiots believe.



Also Julia is bringing back the promise of teaching of how to budget on credit cards etc when Swann broke this promise back in 2008 because it saved $5.4 mil. And the idiots will believe.



Saturday will tell the tale of who can think and who just follows and votes by rote because dear old dad did.



Of course if dear old dad were alive today he would have a mad fit at how the Labor party had changed from what it was to him back then.



I just think that we may have escaped the worst as many parents have struggled to find the fees for a decent education and these young people are no dummies for sure.



If using dummies is so offensive go tell Crikey the left wingers online magazine of choice.



Dear dummies, if you're not using the Labor Party, could we borrow ...



1 Jul 2010 ... Dear dummies, if you're not using the Labor Party, could we borrow it for a while? July 1, 2010 – 5:40 am , by Guy Rundle ...

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../dear-dummies-if-youre-not-using-the-labor-party-could-we-borrow-it-for-a-while/ - Cached



True believers can copy url and read - first bit will thrill them but later may just realize it aint pretty for Labor and these guys are "Not happy Julia".

BTW forgot to say we get the government we deserve they say.



But not so - we get the government voted in by a majority and before they buggered it about was true democracy.



FPTP, no preferences and no compulsory voting was the system.



Now the parties love it and we collectively moan about not getting any parties we want. Other parties don't stand any real chance with these rules which favour 2 majors.



But Saturday will get the government the majority who think or don't think.



And those preferences will alter a lot. Can get Labor over the line if too many punish them by voting Greens who have done a deal and will give their preferences to Labor so if you want to punish - and don't want to vote for the Coalition - just leave the ballot paper with a note to say not voting today and so no one can later fill it in for you.



Greens are intent on making us pay so much for power we have to choose food or comfort from heat or cooling. Just because they can.